[Teenager]

I know that I have signed off to pursue a real life (I made an ENTP friend!) but I have a very important pattern that I've identified and am seeking to change.

It started in my cooking group, and I experienced it just the other day at a debate tournament.

I had an idea, my group mates disagreed and wanted to do something else. I didn't know how to voice my disagreement, so I just let the resentment bubble within me while I did exactly as they said. Their demands grew greater, and I didn't know how to say no. I felt like if I did they would all just gang up on me and force me to do it anyways, only confirming my lack of power. I would occasionally blurt out my anger, and the alpha male (girl) of the group would make sarcastic jokes about what I said and the other group mates would laugh. They would treat me condescendingly, and I didn't know what to do. I just wanted to go crazy and PUNCH THEM ALL IN THEIR ****ING FACES!!! Those bitches, who the hell did they think they were?!

Then just recently I disagreed with my math teacher. She wanted me to show my work on an in class problem (not worth any points. She doesn't check them. You just do them to prove to yourself that you know how to do them.)
I responded, "I don't need to. I know the answer."
"But I need to see how you got the answer."
"Why?"
"So that if you got it wrong I can help you get it right."
"I don't think I got it wrong. I know how to do it. Besides, when have you ever helped me figure out the answer, or even checked my work?"
"You've never written anything down."
"I have written things down."
It was there that I just gave in. I knew that logically I could prove her wrong. I'm the best judge of what works for my learning style, not some teacher who I've barely spoken a few words to. But I was scared that she might do something to me, hurt me some other way... I don't know how, but I gave up.

At the last debate tournament I asked some girl at the snack bar, "Why don't you have pizza?"
and she responded, "Because it's not on the sign,"
I know that I could have knocked her down a few pegs logically, but I didn't. I was a coward and I looked down at the floor and mumbled, "All right."
She had the bitchiest self satisfied smirk. I would have liked to have brought her down. But I didn't.

Is this passive aggression? Why am I allowing others to socially dominate me? Is it my Fe need for acceptance? I remember how I used to deal with these people. I just didn't take them seriously. I mocked them, played little psychological jokes on them by pretending to be weaker than I was so that they would show their true colors.

What is this? I've never felt so pathetic... it's just not me. Did any other ENTPs have a similar experience in their teenage years?

[Aramis]

Ugh, yeah, it's the stupid Fe need for acceptance reeling it's head in an ugly way. I remember going through something really similar at that age. It's particularly worse for female ENTPs. We have bitches to deal with, and they often have their own "code" on top of the normal social rules.

Have you tried pretending to be like them? Put yourself in their shoes, and just have fun with playing a role. Mess with them with their own behavior. It can help you detach from your own paralyzingly-passive-aggressive inclinations.

Gosh, I hope I'm not being a bad influence on you I tried it a lot after high school and instead of giving me more trouble, a lot of the bitchy ones started to take themselves less seriously. It's not going to work if you try it with a friend who has a bitchy moment. Gotta use that move with girls who don't know you well.

[Teenager]

Aramis, on 07 March 2010 - 11:56 PM, said:

Have you tried pretending to be like them? Put yourself in their shoes, and just have fun with playing a role. Mess with them with their own behavior. It can help you detach from your own paralyzingly-passive-aggressive inclinations.

Gosh, I hope I'm not being a bad influence on you I tried it a lot after high school and instead of giving me more trouble, a lot of the bitchy ones started to take themselves less seriously. It's not going to work if you try it with a friend who has a bitchy moment. Gotta use that move with girls who don't know you well.

I used to do that sort of thing before. If they were bullies, I'd play the nerd and pretend to cry (as a joke). Or perhaps I'd be another catty bitch and exaggerate the role to comedic proportions.

What could have caused me to lose those positive coping skills?

This skill allowed me to get along very well with abusive people, and I ended up being drawn to them. Not as central best friends (I prefer those who look up to me for that) but as people I could prove I wasn't sensitive to. Because sensitivity is weakness. It did make for some terrific comedy, because we could act out little improv comedy scenes like "rapist" and "rape victim". And although they were insulting me, I always felt somehow superior to them because they couldn't see that I didn't take them seriously. And I made them laugh.

The problem was that when I moved no one else got it. They didn't know me, and actually thought that my mockery was real, and I wasn't equipped to handle it.
(Bully) "Insult"
(Me) "In character response, maybe 'my mom says I'm cool', something pathetic"
(Bully) "You're MOM! That's a TERRIBLE comeback!"
No shit, it was a joke

I became too accustomed to friendship, to people who were on my side understanding the humor I was creating and laughing with me. I found people who thought I was funny. They laughed at my jokes (when they were direct). But they could never respond like my friends did.

I think the key component of this method is detachment. If you aren't comfortable with being the only one who understands the jokes you're making, being entirely emotionally removed, it won't work. It didn't work for me because I expected people to get it, and some part of me sought their approval. Because I sought social approval I gave up the minute others didn't get it as opposed to crafting another in character response.

I've noticed that this method also requires a certain level of emotional vulnerability and anger. The emotional vulnerability allows for honesty (critical in acting/ comedy) and the anger really drives it home and gives it the life and exaggeration required of parody.

The only person this doesn't work with is my little brother, because he's an ****. Whenever I make a joke he says, "You always make jokes when you're serious about something and you don't want to be taken seriously. You're serious about X." How do I respond? "YOU'RE RUINING MY DEFENSE MECHANISM!"

[Northern Bushape]

I've gone through and am going through a similar thing. I think what has happened is you have slipped from Extrovert to Introvert and you are now interacting with the world as an Introvert with Extrovert past experiences and mindset. This can be a real mindfuck as you are projecting your primary inner world onto your secondary outer world, expecting them to jive, as they did when you were an extrovert, but they do not.


Extraverts' energy is directed primarily outward, towards people and things outside of themselves. Introverts' energy is primarily directed inward, towards their own thoughts, perceptions, and reactions. Therefore, Extraverts tend to be more naturally active, expressive, social, and interested in many things, whereas Introverts tend to be more reserved, private, cautious, and interested in fewer interactions, but with greater depth and focus.

You are probably an x now, and that creates challenges and opportunities. I had problems with trusting my perception for most of my life, which is a problem, because of my balance in S and N. Luckily I found the instructions on my brain and all is well now, except I have been doing some odd interactions with people, at times, of late, as I am transitioning currently from I to E.

As for dealing with bitchy girls, so glad I never was one, but I sneeze glitter

What does that mean?

[ShashiJapan4]

Dude, why all the bad vibes?

Stop thinking of how much more superior you are than them and learn to level.
When they make a joke about you, don't repress it- Go with it. I'm not saying snap back. Just go with the joke. Rip on them right back, but without malice. You'll enjoy their presence more and vice-versa. Set yourself apart, but be on their level. Simplest way to put it.

Fastest way is to stop thinking you're so goddamn superior.
It'll make it easier to communicate your idea to them. Lots of understanding is lost when you try to communicate an idea to someone only verbally. You don't have to compromise the idea- You just have to compromise the words you're saying. And you don't have to try to show off your intelligence every chance you get, or put others down, man.
That's just bad vibes all around.
Why does someone else have to meet YOUR standards before you actually interact with them?
The earlier you learn this, the faster it'll help you.

The Buddha taught not of getting customers, but making friends; surpassing the man who taught him the way of currency and material.
It's a simple matter of not judging others and not expecting anything of them.

[Northern Bushape]

As for your humor bombing, the reason might be because you are doing inside jokes, with yourself, to a degree, an introvert thing.

And this too shall pass.

I've been watching some of the hard core extroverts in the bar, every night. Slaves to their need for other people. They become lost and imprisoned in others, detached and lost from themselves. Quite pathetic, when you perceive them in the extrovert context.

This whole experience has the potential to make you a better rounded person, stressful at the moment, but maybe useful long term

[Teenager]

ShashiJapan4, on 08 March 2010 - 12:15 PM, said:

Dude, why all the bad vibes?

Stop thinking of how much more superior you are than them and learn to level.

Fastest way is to stop thinking you're so goddamn superior.
And you don't have to try to show off your intelligence every chance you get, or put others down, man.
That's just bad vibes all around.
Why does someone else have to meet YOUR standards before you actually interact with them?
The earlier you learn this, the faster it'll help you.

I never claimed that I was superior to anyone. The problem is that my self esteem has taken a hit and I need to convince myself that I am superior in order to feel confident in my interactions with others.

Bushape, you might be right. I could very well have become an XNTP. Just recently I visited with friends from before my teenage depressive stage, and they said that I was noticeably different. They said I was much more serious (which I attribute to the development of Ti), and there was more silence than we usually had. They claimed that I had been "hardened by life". Another common symptom I've had is a closed off throat. Even when I try to talk my throat physically won't let me.

So, must one die for the other to live?

The benefit of extroversion is fun, the downside is vulnerability (others may misinterpret my words/ actions and attack). The benefit of introversion is safety and logical development, the downside is depression and lack of friends/ accomplishment. I still see myself as an extrovert, and was shocked when people first called me shy. But it's been nearly three years now... so my personality could have been altered.

What's the best way to integrate the two worlds?

I stood up to my math teacher! I explained logically, she was annoyed with me ("You're not exactly getting 100 percents") but I won!

[Northern Bushape]

Being in High School is like being in prison, you are locked in with people, not necessarily of your choosing and most have issues and act like selfish and mean children. When you catch parole, you get much more freedom to choose your extroverted interactions. It makes it much easier to make a smooth transition.

I always envied I's when I was hard core E, I actually sought out social isolation, so as to develop my I, so as to have more control of my life and relationships. It is really easy for me to slip back and forth now.

If I was you I would make lemonade, spruce up your hole, quit struggling, relax and just let the whole thing play out.

[SpiralHacker]

I had the opposite experience as a child; I voiced my opinions freely, and sometimes this landed me in trouble. I was known for being laid back funny, and I wouldn’t make a fuss about pizza, but I gave teachers a lot of trouble and anyone promoting religion or anything of the sort – I was a trouble maker when it came to expectations, but not in the typical sense - I just refused to do anything except what I thought was best and wasn’t really a compromising person. Basically, as it is to this day, there’s some principles I don’t compromise on, or stay quiet on, and everything else is what’s best for the context (negotiation).

I see no point in fighting with your teacher in that context. I suspect she just wanted to be a good teacher, and I suspect that you’re in a fight with yourself and you took it as her being on the antagonists’ side. I also see no point in fighting with a girl minding her own business, not eating pizza. “People look strange when you’re a stranger” – when you’re beating yourself up about things, you project the state onto others easily…watch out for it.

These are not examples of social dominance. Social dominance would be someone of higher rank in some social structure oppressing you and using their social context to harass you – or for someone to force you to do things you don’t want to do –you going along with things, or even others suggesting things to you are not social oppression.

Sounds like you’re having a hard time, you’ll make your way through it – just keep working on it, there will be some bends and such along the way, but everyone makes it somehow or another through such experiences.

You are in control and responsible for your own emotions and well-being, as is everyone else. Others only influence you because you let yourself be influenced in those ways, and it sounds like you’re mostly upset with yourself for not being self-determined enough. So, work on self-determination and don’t worry about the other people.

If you got a moment for a book, I recommend Choice Theory by Glasser (amazon link). It’ll help with understanding why it really is up to you how you feel, and he goes through a lot of examples of applying self-direction in a myriad of contexts. I got this for a friend who was having some related confusion, and it helped out a lot. I got similar perspectives from eastern philosophy.

In the end, self-actualization and developing our potential goes beyond just Choice Theory. As far as I can tell, it never ends. There’s always going to be some new confusions, so don’t trip out on tripping out itself –life’s a trip. Enjoy the trip.

[Teenager]

SpiralHacker, on 08 March 2010 - 07:28 PM, said:

I had the opposite experience as a child; I voiced my opinions freely, and sometimes this landed me in trouble. I was known for being laid back funny, and I wouldn’t make a fuss about pizza, but I gave teachers a lot of trouble and anyone promoting religion or anything of the sort – I was a trouble maker when it came to expectations, but not in the typical sense - I just refused to do anything except what I thought was best and wasn’t really a compromising person. Basically, as it is to this day, there’s some principles I don’t compromise on, or stay quiet on, and everything else is what’s best for the context (negotiation).

I see no point in fighting with your teacher in that context. I suspect she just wanted to be a good teacher, and I suspect that you’re in a fight with yourself and you took it as her being on the antagonists’ side. I also see no point in fighting with a girl minding her own business, not eating pizza. “People look strange when you’re a stranger” – when you’re beating yourself up about things, you project the state onto others easily…watch out for it.

My teacher awards extra credit for printing out notes. She says that she is revoking my extra credit because I don't fill them in. I said, "That's unfair. You say that you award extra credit for printing them out. You ask people to hold up their blank notes in order to receive credit."
She said, "The purpose of printing them out is to fill them in." I said, "Well, if you're holding me to that standard, why don't you base everyone's extra credit on the completion of notes? Why not wait until people have taken notes and then give them the credit for having filled them in?" She took the liberty of emailing my parents, and she also moved me to the back so that another student could have the "educational opportunity" of sitting in the front next to a partner (although if you saw his reaction when he was moved he was not exactly thrilled with the "educational opportunity").

The girl wasn't not eating pizza... she was manding the snack bar. All other snack bars at tournaments have pizza, they had baked potatoes, so I asked, "Why don't you have pizza?" it was just a question.



I think that this is related to social conditioning.

When we are young we try different methods of communication in order to see which one is most effective. As a young child I found the confrontational approach most effective (my dad wouldn't listen to me unless I yelled at him. One time I tried being polite... my whole family ignored me.) However, what worked earlier began to fail me in later elementary and middle school. Parents, teachers, and peers rejected me. Therefore, a new method of communication was established: silence/ withdrawal. Silence/ withdrawal is an effective means of preventing pain, but is entirely ineffective in communicating with others.

Original method of communication: Yell at people
Self preservation method of communication: Don't say anything or disagree because (based on past experiences) everyone will hate you

This creates conflict, which manifests itself as passive aggression.

[Northern Bushape]

Without a solid thinking function, the ENTP can easily discount or fail to notice the essential ethics of social and interpersonal relationship, often considering themselves “above” or untouched by such limiting values and often discounting the possibility that their actions might be or hurtful or seen as unethical by others. It is not that the one sided ENTP is deliberately hurtful, but simply ignorant of the effects which can flow from their often compulsive need for change or need to show how clever or individual they are. In the ENTP, the lack of a well developed Feeling Function means that they must learn to “understand” feeling in both themselves and others and come to terms with its affects. This understanding can only come from thinking carefully about the ways feeling affects not only themselves, but others, and the importance others place on this function. The ENTP has a feeling function more or less global in character and one which does not judge fine differences. This inability to discriminate feelings can allow the ENTP to say and do much that leaves others in the cold, so an effort to think about the feeling process can be essential. Without the understanding this brings, the ENTP can separate themselves from the ground of their life, from the constancy of their friends and family and, without even realizing it, they can easily find themselves in untenable positions where, without support, they wonder why they are suddenly alone and lost.

http://www.personali...m/ENTP_per.html

[Teenager]

Northern Bushape, on 10 March 2010 - 09:13 PM, said:

Without a solid thinking function, the ENTP can easily discount or fail to notice the essential ethics of social and interpersonal relationship, often considering themselves “above” or untouched by such limiting values and often discounting the possibility that their actions might be or hurtful or seen as unethical by others. It is not that the one sided ENTP is deliberately hurtful, but simply ignorant of the effects which can flow from their often compulsive need for change or need to show how clever or individual they are. In the ENTP, the lack of a well developed Feeling Function means that they must learn to “understand” feeling in both themselves and others and come to terms with its affects. This understanding can only come from thinking carefully about the ways feeling affects not only themselves, but others, and the importance others place on this function. The ENTP has a feeling function more or less global in character and one which does not judge fine differences. This inability to discriminate feelings can allow the ENTP to say and do much that leaves others in the cold, so an effort to think about the feeling process can be essential. Without the understanding this brings, the ENTP can separate themselves from the ground of their life, from the constancy of their friends and family and, without even realizing it, they can easily find themselves in untenable positions where, without support, they wonder why they are suddenly alone and lost.

http://www.personali...m/ENTP_per.html

I agree. I feel like I am above feelings and personal relationships. They just tie you down with obligations. In fact, I flaunt my social ignorance. I see it as a sign of not being weak. It gives me a chance to criticize those who are offended by my social ignorance for being weak. I never really thought about the fact that my Feeling function does not judge fine differences because it is underdeveloped. I thought about how I never understood when people made statements like, "I love you but I'm not in love with you." (ABC family original movie. Heather Locklear on her relationship with a computer.) I just thought, "Love is love! An emotional attachment for biological purposes!"

I read that page. I agree. This is a problem I have. I am not a very effective communicator. I only have two settings: yelling and not talking. It's definitely something I need to work on, and have been seeing an improvement with Ti. I remember just last year before the Ti I was all Ne and I used to spout BS. I had a need to just say whatever came to mind in order to answer the question fast enough to seem confident and capable.

How do other ENTPS communicate? I tend to communicate as such:

No eye contact
I speak very quickly. Most of what I have to say is an interjection ("Oh! That just reminds me!"), and I try to go fast so that the conversation can get back on track when I'm done (I don't intend to derail it) and no one will interrupt me
Weird hand gestures, lots of tension and grabbing and drawing things out in the air
Shifting from side to side
Squinting my eyes skeptically as I listen or try to search for the right words

I'm also terrible at listening. You guys have complained about providing me with advice that I did not respond to or take. That's pretty typical of me. I'm figuring things out in my own little world. Occasionally someone will give me some great advice and I'll be like, "Yeah!" but generally when I talk to others about things in my life I'm not really listening to them. I just like the opportunity to talk about my problems to someone because summarizing and presenting them helps me to better understand my own situation.

This is what's killing me in debate. My opponents and judges all criticize that I don't address my opponents case. Why? Because I probably wasn't listening. I was probably trying to predict what they were going to say and drafting up my own rebuttal.

These could be beneficial skills, but developing them seems like a real pain. I don't want to care about others! Then when they wanted me to do things I'd have to do them, and if they insulted me I'd be hurt, and they might make me less ME.

[HughNibley]

It sounds to me like you have two issues. First, you seem to take things very personally. And the second, you are trying to take people head on, at their own games.

First; I would abandon the notion that people are that concerned about you. Especially at your age, everyone is self-absorbed. They barely take notice of anyone else. When they make fun of others, it has nothing to do with a deficiency in the others, it has to do with a deficiency in themselves. The tauntees, specifically, are personally irrelevant to the taunters. The shit-eating grin from the girl at the food stand had nothing to do with you. Who cares if she smiles or gave a snippy answer or not. I had not a thing to do with you.

Second, you're trying to approach these situations head on. That is wrong. If you supposedly have these gifts of intuition and intelligence, then use them. Everyone is an expert when in familiar territory, so, quit hanging out in familiar territory. Do some social architecting. Tread your own path, and people will obediently follow you as their guide, because they know no different.

For example, take pizza girl. Were I in that situation, I would likely approach her with a statement similar to "I cannot believe that the food commission would slight you like this." The confused response would likely ask me to repeat myself, where I'd say "You know, the food commission. The ones that decide everyone else gets pizza but you. I won't stand for it." At that point, the person would laugh, a bit confused about where the conversation was going, but most likely give the utterly mundane answer as to why they didn't serve pizza.

As for the Teacher asking to see your work? I'd accuse the teacher of not knowing how to do it, and telling her you *can't* show the work... for her own good. Because, if she doesn't learn how to do it herself... she'll never be able to succeed in life.

My specific answers here are irrelevant. But the concept is not. You choose to interact in ways that are well established, and you're admittedly unpracticed in. So, choose to interact in ways that you're more practiced than they.

And... really, if most of us realized how rarely people thought about us, we wouldn't be concerned about what they thought.

[Teenager]

HughNibley, on 11 March 2010 - 12:40 AM, said:

It sounds to me like you have two issues. First, you seem to take things very personally. And the second, you are trying to take people head on, at their own games.

First; I would abandon the notion that people are that concerned about you. Especially at your age, everyone is self-absorbed. They barely take notice of anyone else. When they make fun of others, it has nothing to do with a deficiency in the others, it has to do with a deficiency in themselves.

Second, you're trying to approach these situations head on. That is wrong. If you supposedly have these gifts of intuition and intelligence, then use them. Everyone is an expert when in familiar territory, so, quit hanging out in familiar territory. Do some social architecting. Tread your own path, and people will obediently follow you as their guide, because they know no different.

My specific answers here are irrelevant. But the concept is not. You choose to interact in ways that are well established, and you're admittedly unpracticed in. So, choose to interact in ways that you're more practiced than they.

And... really, if most of us realized how rarely people thought about us, we wouldn't be concerned about what they thought.

I don't take the insults themselves personally, but it's the fact that others think I belong to the "victim" group that gets to me. I must look weak. A lot of my anger is directed at myself... how could I let them walk all over me?

I am not very effective head on, I agree. I feel like a bitch when I do it too.

It seems like a common ENTP coping mechanism is humor. There's a comedy mode that I haven't been able to tap into since my intuition began to explore darker things. My mind tries to box itself in in an attempt to feel safe, but it really just leads to depression.

How do you guys feel about conflict? I find that I can't leave a situation with it. After I've said what I need to say, and the other person is pissed off, I feel like I need to do some clean up. Make a joke about the situation, relate to them or something. I don't want them to go start some covert drama, talking to other people and stirring up a new passive aggressive conflict.

[HughNibley]

tealpenguin326, on 11 March 2010 - 02:30 PM, said:

I don't take the insults themselves personally, but it's the fact that others think I belong to the "victim" group that gets to me. I must look weak. A lot of my anger is directed at myself... how could I let them walk all over me?

Right. You've taken it personally. You've internalized the actions of someone else and have interpreted them as a flaw on your part. Their actions have nothing to do with you, yet you view your action or inaction as weak. Really; half of the solution is realizing that they, and their actions, do not matter.

tealpenguin326, on 11 March 2010 - 02:30 PM, said:

How do you guys feel about conflict? I find that I can't leave a situation with it. After I've said what I need to say, and the other person is pissed off, I feel like I need to do some clean up. Make a joke about the situation, relate to them or something. I don't want them to go start some covert drama, talking to other people and stirring up a new passive aggressive conflict.

I don't mind conflict. Sometimes I love it. I probably should like it less... I used to be pretty timid about it, until I realized most everyone was far more scared than I was. I've long since given up responsibility for other people's emotions and reactions. I own my own, but I don't own anyone else's. If you've done right by your own internal standards, and the other person is pissed off, it is their own issue. You owe them nothing.

[Teenager]

HughNibley, on 11 March 2010 - 10:38 PM, said:

Right. You've taken it personally. You've internalized the actions of someone else and have interpreted them as a flaw on your part. Their actions have nothing to do with you, yet you view your action or inaction as weak. Really; half of the solution is realizing that they, and their actions, do not matter.

I don't mind conflict. Sometimes I love it. I probably should like it less... I used to be pretty timid about it, until I realized most everyone was far more scared than I was. I've long since given up responsibility for other people's emotions and reactions. I own my own, but I don't own anyone else's. If you've done right by your own internal standards, and the other person is pissed off, it is their own issue. You owe them nothing.

Alright, fine. If others perceive my actions as weak then they must have distorted perception... all of them.

I myself see my actions as weak, regardless of their opinion. I admit to being weak where I should have been assertive. I am personally critical of myself, and others negative feedback only heightens my self criticism.

The social acceptance part of me right now is overpowering. Logically I know I shouldn't... all my actions will be dictated by other people, I'll be hurt by what they think, I SHOULDN'T care, and yet I am drawn to it. Should I let myself try for social acceptance and learn through the pain of rejection and failure, or continue to hold myself back from trying in order to prevent the inevitable pain?

Will the need for connection/ acceptance pass once I've gotten some or once I've given up?

[decided]

Hi Teal, nice to see you back.

tealpenguin326, on 11 March 2010 - 07:24 PM, said:

I don't want to care about others! Then when they wanted me to do things I'd have to do them, and if they insulted me I'd be hurt, and they might make me less ME.

Yeah, there is an inherent vulnerability in opening up to / caring about people. They could insult you or betray you, or be thoughtlessly harmful.
Takes a certain sort of courage to let people into your life, and trust that they won't hurt you.

Caring about another person doesn't make you have to do things for them; it makes you want to do things for them.
You would still have control over yourself, and you would still do what you want.

What do you mean you would be less YOU?
Do you mean that you might have an identity crisis if you start caring for others?

tealpenguin326, on 12 March 2010 - 10:30 AM, said:

I don't take the insults themselves personally, but it's the fact that others think I belong to the "victim" group that gets to me. I must look weak. A lot of my anger is directed at myself... how could I let them walk all over me?

Take what they are thinking - that you are a victim - and reject it.

Spin their idea around. Think of yourself not as a victim but as a survivor.

With a survivor mentality you will feel stronger and look stronger.



Hope that helps a little bit.

[Munchies]

listen to sashi's first post if you want to fix your problem. youve already realised its an issue of social dominance but havnt realised you that makes the peoblem reality,not the other people. theres No WAY that you can somehow read the minds of other people,so get your head out of your ass and listen to sashi. and say thank you

[drmiller100]

Munchies, on 31 August 2010 - 07:11 PM, said:

listen to sashi's first post if you want to fix your problem. youve already realised its an issue of social dominance but havnt realised you that makes the peoblem reality,not the other people. theres No WAY that you can somehow read the minds of other people,so get your head out of your ass and listen to sashi. and say thank you

a great thread.

thanks munchies for reviving it.